Huh, I didn't find this portrayal of Biden endearing (with the [exception] of the fundraising call) but your point makes me reevaluate my response to the attacks on Sen. Klobuchar. It's not a trait I admire, but if it doesn't make me greatly reconsider Biden it probably shouldn't have shaped my views of Klobuchar.
I don’t want to appear to dismiss your point, because it’s entirely reasonable. In fact, it’s clear to me that I need to think the way you’re thinking, generally.
But I read that Klobuchar literally threw a binder at a staffer’s head. Is it possible that I see that as beyond the pale, and not just because she’s a lady? Is it possible that some behavior by women shouldn’t be excused, even as we get more honest about this double standard?
There certainly should be a line. I think this is something I may discuss with some staffers I know. As I do suspect even if Klobuchar is over that line there's probably five to ten times as many men who have also crossed it, including some who I find quite admirable based on their public [persona].
I do ultimately feel the harsh reasons to Franken on a different category of conduct was a painful but correct call, though in that case there was minimal risk of a double standard. Standards should be higher for presidential candidates, and don't throw hard objects at your staff is not an unreasonable one, but I think it will take some work to make sure penalties for uncontrolled anger don't disproportionately fall on women.
Comparative note: Dominic Raab was driven out of the UK Cabinet over "bullying", which included yelling at the UK Ambassador to Spain over the ambassador's suggesting a greater concession over Gibraltar to Spain than the Cabinet had authorized and "angrily" throwing a tomato into a paper bag. (Some have suggested that it was Saab's demanding style that prompted the civil service to go after him. He was widely seen as effective.) I'd say neither Biden or Trump would last in a UK government based on that standard.
Serious question: do we care if the president is a nice person? At one level, being a kind, etc. person signals good values. And I'd like them to treat career staff with respect, etc. But lots of the time, I think I'd prefer a very Type A, hard charging president to a lovable, cuddly one. If an aide hasn't delivered, it's not a bad thing if the aide gets yelled at.
Well yes, because upper-end American and British social norms are different. I mean, there’s a reason why the Brits have a reputation for maintaining a stiff upper lip.
Ha. Her marketing of herself is very odd. She gave a terrific talk on reparations at the Harvard School of Divinity but she never mentions this. She told the New Yorker that she has no crystals in her house and is a nice Jewish lady who does yoga. Why she rocks the woo woo lady image on the campaign trail is a mystery. I was kinda glad to learn that she has a temper...
That was an interesting (and sensible) read but I'll need evidence to believe that there was some clever political marketing scheme afoot when news of Biden's less than perfect temper control leaked out.
I'm amused that no one noticed Joe Biden had a temper before this.
That would have been my guess 20 years ago.
Watch the debates again. You can see him holding himself back.
But what I take away from it is that Joe Biden controls his temper. And he wields it like a weapon.
Donald Trump's temper was like one of those geysers in Yellowstone - blowing up on a regular basis for a good photo op but not useful.
Biden's is like a steam engine. Powering a Gatling gun.
Huh, I didn't find this portrayal of Biden endearing (with the [exception] of the fundraising call) but your point makes me reevaluate my response to the attacks on Sen. Klobuchar. It's not a trait I admire, but if it doesn't make me greatly reconsider Biden it probably shouldn't have shaped my views of Klobuchar.
I don’t want to appear to dismiss your point, because it’s entirely reasonable. In fact, it’s clear to me that I need to think the way you’re thinking, generally.
But I read that Klobuchar literally threw a binder at a staffer’s head. Is it possible that I see that as beyond the pale, and not just because she’s a lady? Is it possible that some behavior by women shouldn’t be excused, even as we get more honest about this double standard?
There certainly should be a line. I think this is something I may discuss with some staffers I know. As I do suspect even if Klobuchar is over that line there's probably five to ten times as many men who have also crossed it, including some who I find quite admirable based on their public [persona].
I do ultimately feel the harsh reasons to Franken on a different category of conduct was a painful but correct call, though in that case there was minimal risk of a double standard. Standards should be higher for presidential candidates, and don't throw hard objects at your staff is not an unreasonable one, but I think it will take some work to make sure penalties for uncontrolled anger don't disproportionately fall on women.
Absolutely, that double standard is very real.
The sheer talent in that SNL sketch. I remember seeing it when it aired.
Phil Hartman, absolute genius.
Comparative note: Dominic Raab was driven out of the UK Cabinet over "bullying", which included yelling at the UK Ambassador to Spain over the ambassador's suggesting a greater concession over Gibraltar to Spain than the Cabinet had authorized and "angrily" throwing a tomato into a paper bag. (Some have suggested that it was Saab's demanding style that prompted the civil service to go after him. He was widely seen as effective.) I'd say neither Biden or Trump would last in a UK government based on that standard.
Serious question: do we care if the president is a nice person? At one level, being a kind, etc. person signals good values. And I'd like them to treat career staff with respect, etc. But lots of the time, I think I'd prefer a very Type A, hard charging president to a lovable, cuddly one. If an aide hasn't delivered, it's not a bad thing if the aide gets yelled at.
Well yes, because upper-end American and British social norms are different. I mean, there’s a reason why the Brits have a reputation for maintaining a stiff upper lip.
Amy Klobuchar, Kamala Harris, and now Marianne Williamson is being called unfit for office because of private snger at staff.
To be fair, when folks say that Marianne Williamson is unfit for office I'm not sure her gender has much to do with it.
Ha. Her marketing of herself is very odd. She gave a terrific talk on reparations at the Harvard School of Divinity but she never mentions this. She told the New Yorker that she has no crystals in her house and is a nice Jewish lady who does yoga. Why she rocks the woo woo lady image on the campaign trail is a mystery. I was kinda glad to learn that she has a temper...
Not odd at all when you realize that she’s more about maximizing her earnings.
That was an interesting (and sensible) read but I'll need evidence to believe that there was some clever political marketing scheme afoot when news of Biden's less than perfect temper control leaked out.
Is Joe Biden yelling at waiters? The Marine guards?
What makes you think his control isn't perfect?
Nicest man I ever worked for used his temper like a weapon and got great results. I've done it myself.
My guess is more that it’s a question of “can the Dems spin this” than “was this specifically deliberate”.
Yes Alec. Scheming plans sound more satisfying but your guess sounds rather more likley.